Jan. 11, 2021

Apple Watch & Oura Ring Review | Using Tech to Build Healthier Habits

Apple Watch & Oura Ring Review | Using Tech to Build Healthier Habits

What we like and dislike about health/wellness devices & how we've adjusted our health routines

Ryan and Heather chat about fitness trackers and building healthy habits.


  • Apple Watch Series 3 vs 6
  • Ryan's experience with a Workplace Resilience & Wellbeing report
  • Oura Ring
  • Intermittent fasting
  • Goal and boundary setting 
  • Finding motivation

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Ryan Purvis  0:00  
Hello, and welcome to the digital workspace works podcast. I'm Ryan Purvis, your host supported by producer Heather Bicknell. In this series, you'll hear stories and opinions from experts in the field story from the frontlines, the problems they face and how they solve them. The years they're focused on from technology, people and processes to the approaches they took that will help you to get to the scripts for the digital workspace inner workings.

Hey, how's it going? Hey,

how's everything?

Heather Bicknell  0:38  

Ryan Purvis  0:39  

Heather Bicknell  0:40  
I thought I might have bricked my Apple watch this morning. I think it's okay. But, um, so it was pushing the watch Oh, seven update on me. And when I went to update it partway through the update, it was like, Oh, you don't have enough space, because I think you need like over three gigs. Free. And of course, the whole watch, I have a series three. So the whole thing is like six gigs, which already is like, I don't have very much, you know, living on it. So it's like already just the operating system taking up all that space. So I couldn't back out of the update to settings to actually try to clear anything. So I just had to reset, factory reset my watch. So I think it's okay, but I was worried for a minute there that it was it was gonna be unusable. That's my morning.

Ryan Purvis  1:28  
Yeah. Now, I have exact same problem with my, well, my serious two did that to me. And I ended up having to reset the whole thing as well, which was really irritating because you lose all your progress. And, you know, just just a poor experience. Really. I've just gone to the new one. What is this one? This is a series six. And I have to say I'm very impressed. Are you ready? Yeah.

Heather Bicknell  1:54  
Is it worth the upgrade?

Ryan Purvis  1:58  
Yes, yes. Now, I say that in the sense of I don't pay full price for it. So it's worth it from that point of view. So what happens with me is my medical plan, they give you an incentive, if you do your 12 and a half 1000 steps a day, or you do your 30 minutes exercise in a day, they give you points. And as long as you make 160 points in a month, they pay 12 pound 50 towards your watch over a two year period. So so basically you pay 170 bucks up front for the watch. And then the balance of that whatever is left over is paid off by your your performance. So it's a great application. So yeah, so that's what I do. So I didn't pay full price, but I had to wait till my contract ended and I had to wait till they got to stop that the wife had been waiting for like a month. I mean, I mean I do I just buy it and then sell the when I get something like that often. I'll just wait. I'll just wait. I finally got it. But it's it's definitely worth the weight if you use the watch every day. And we'll talk about notifications and stuff that just the general things like that. what's what's on the displays, like the weather and what time sundown is and what type of naked appointment is and what kind of stuff. It's really really awesome to see. Just now perfect.

Unknown Speaker  3:29  

Ryan Purvis  3:30  
So if anyone like I said, I think it is worthwhile. In my humble opinion,

Unknown Speaker  3:39  
so how's your day gone so far?

Ryan Purvis  3:43  
Okay, well, like I say, just just released Jade's podcast episode came out really good. I was very impressed with that. And I also did a couple weeks ago, I did a psychometric test, workplace test for stress. It's run by a lady that I met on the tuition on executive with them upon have emitted the results today. And it was quite good, quite insightful. So we'll record an episode with her to discuss the results. And some of the things that are those results. I think it's quite useful, useful thing. kind of see if I can find the actual it's called a war. War.

Heather Bicknell  4:31  
It's a surveyor. How does it work?

Ryan Purvis  4:33  
Yeah, so she's a psychologist. So what is it called? It's called a Here we go. Here's the file. A raw A w. w. w, workplace resilience and well being report. Sounds like yeah, so it's a psychometric test. And basically, they they go through the four or five pillars energy future focus in a drive flexible thinking and struggling Yeah, no, I mean, steal too much around this because we will interview to talk about it. But that was quite insightful. Because if you think about, you know, people's general mental state going through the pandemic, and that it's made everything that much worse, more desperate not to say that in the non work environment, things aren't stressful usually, or you've got your challenges around, keeping your energy up, you know, having that having the motivation to do things, all those sorts of things. So the reason why I did it, I thought be really interesting because of, we're going into another lockdown again. But as interesting how the lock is locked, and how it affected me at all, in some way of measuring and beyond my own personal viewpoint, you know, we always like to have something to measure. And yeah, it was it is insightful. So we talked for about two hours today on this, I don't think we'll talk for two hours to the episode, but I thought it'd be a good thing to shoot, just talk about the theoretical stuff, but actually have someone for this questionnaire and then talk about it. So the results of the high level are good. The other thing I was thinking good episode, as you call the baseball stuff out.

Heather Bicknell  6:17  
It was just it was like a lot of preamble before the intro to Jad. So

Ryan Purvis  6:24  
I'm totally fine with that I didn't think you're gonna keep but I did think while I was driving around listening to going well, you know, it'd be really cool, actually, because we cut out a lot of stuff. all the episodes, we were really cool to have, like, a bloopers reel. But every so often just put together like this is this, this is the uncut version, or these are the pieces we're cutting out. You know, they'll just, you know, think of it and you don't need. Yeah, what's involved? You know, you don't I mean, you personally don't need to put a front and a back on it. It's literally maybe maybe just put a warning. This is just a button above and it's out of context. But just you know, sometimes there's something in there we've kind of because maybe maybe we run out of time, whatever it is that people might find interesting. Or just blooper, funny.

Heather Bicknell  7:13  
I'll have to I'll start a running file of that when I cut stuff out.

Ryan Purvis  7:19  
Yeah, I'll leave it to to discretion. I just thought it was for making keep it a real people might be interested to know, but certainly talk about it as part of the preamble, for example.

Heather Bicknell  7:33  
Yeah, for sure. I kind of right now I kind of play it like it depends, you know, how many minutes? Did it take? You know, I don't know, kind of make that judgment call per case. But I think yeah, it's it's nice to have some stuff that's not you know, always straight to business, I guess. So.

Ryan Purvis  7:55  
I'm just looking at my window. I cycled my bike in with the covers back on, and it started raining. So the hammer needs, it needs a good clean. We had a whole lot of things on our list we wanted to go through. We've talked already a bit about using tech to change habits Apple Watch the list this morning. So so using tech to change habits, so besides Apple I chose to wear an aura ring. Oh, you are a which is something that you know, in a lot of the podcasts I listen to the headphones, at least they bring up using a ring or something similar to measure heart rate variability. An idea of iron heart rate variability is a very layman term is that proportion to your stress. So if an executive finishes but but in essence, you're trying to bring your HRV down, we've possible and then you bring it down and doing things like meditation or focus breathing, etc. And it tells you where you are from a stress point of view. But it also helps you with your recovery. So the ordering want to measure my sleep, make sure I'm getting good quality sleep and into when I meditate to make sure that it's going down as well. So normally I do sort of a 10 minute 15 minute meditation during the day. So first thing I'm looking forward to see the HRV is coming down and the body temperature is also going down which are all signs that you're managing your stress. So that's something that's been quite key through lockdowns and such and then I make sure that I do 30 minutes of exercise at least every day. So I don't know what you're doing to keep yourself sane.

Heather Bicknell  9:48  
Depends on how busy the week is. I'm sure you'll I know we have the the watch sharing on so I'm sure you'll notice that that there's some weeks where I actually close things and then Some weeks where I just, I'm tied to my desk literally all day, which is not good. And I think I'm still struggling with that work life balance, you know, just, you know, before I walked to work, so that commute was always, you know, basically an hour of exercise built into my day, which was great. But now I'm using that extra hour to work more. I haven't really fix that yet. Oh, she's been so quiet

Ryan Purvis  10:30  
for a while. Hey, you interfering? She said her vaccinations that I said she's a little bit grouchy? Yeah. Yeah, I think that's something that everyone's missing that is that can be to work the buffer. So it's enough I have to, I have to make a concerted effort to do the exercise, I have to get up early. Because if I leave it to during the day is always some work thing that takes over. Yeah, as long work, then it's one of the children needing something so you never get that half an hour. Because you really really need the half an hour dedicated time to get you know, sweetie enough that God can see the benefit from it. So from so I forced myself, it's four o'clock in the morning, good morning, whatever it is to do something. The other thing I do is intermittent fasting, which I also find makes a big difference. And that sets me there for about two years now. I would definitely recommend if you had to do what,

Heather Bicknell  11:33  
what window do you choose for eating. Um,

Ryan Purvis  11:38  
so this is something that that's interesting. So I've actually pushed as long as I can, which could be anywhere from 16 hours to 20 hours, depending on the day. But my my app that I use to measure which is called zero, is set to 12 hours to 12 hours is the minimum time for you to see any benefit. And the reason why I've said it's 12 hours, because it means every day, you can do 12 hours, could you sleep for six, seven hours, you can be busy enough that you don't feel hungry, you know, before or after either side of your sleeping. And you're seeing some benefit. And then 12 hours is pretty much go as long as you can. So like today, I think was 1818 hours, 10 minutes, okay. And the reason why I said lower is it's always a feel good incentive because you know, you've hit your target. And there's a secondary thing to see how far can you stretch it? Because what I was finding the 16 hours is I'm getting hungry to buy 15. And then it's very easy at home to just walk downstairs, open the fridge and take something out. Yeah. Whereas the military 12 hours of cheap 12. Now how far can I push it to a different mindset, it's actually something that IBM used to do in their sales targets, and they set a sales targets quite low. And then the sales guys would hit those targets quite easily. And then there would be there was accelerators to hit more. And we drive a distance. So that it would drive them and drive them to be more competitive, around stretching out the target as opposed to a negative thing about Oh, you haven't retired yet. So you know, you're failing.

Unknown Speaker  13:25  

Heather Bicknell  13:25  
that's an interesting behavioral kind of way to structure things. Because I feel like I'm more familiar with the, we're gonna set your targets so high, that really what we need is lower. But we want you to try to hit the upper target. But I'd be curious to see which one is truly, you know, more effective. In the end? Well, there

Ryan Purvis  13:47  
have been studies on that it says something wrong with having, you know, the tall, the high goal wherever they go. But you need to break it down into the smallest achievable thing, and you won't have lots of small, achievable things that lead up to that goal. That's the sort of cause in principle, 1% better every day, at the end of the time is 65% improvement at a minimum and actually a lot more wins exponential, because you know, you're getting 1% on the previous 1% plus 1%. And that's the that's when people miss it is that because you, you create this unattainable goal, which you never get to. So you never just give up at some point that can be really, really, really strong, strong minded, like like that US Marine guy. David Goggins is a complete machine. He does all if you haven't looked him up, he does all these things like he's done the most pull ups in a row, which is like 4600 and something. Now I can do three in a row, you know, moving on to for next week. So think about trying to 4000 and he thought the thing that you're you're his motivation is that when you get to your limit, you're only 40%, there, she can still go another 60%. And that's just you breaking your your brains mentality. But going back to the point around the targets, if you set the target low and you attain the target, then you go to the next target setup with which you approach it has already been positive, because you've already achieved something. And as high targets have never worked, I mean, I remember in southern gazaway, you know, seven, eight figure targets, and they were selling something with average deal size was like, you know, four or five figures, which means you ended up 100 deals, and you're selling software to get those deals titles alone, which means you have them offline, you know, five times six times your enclosure, enclosure numbers. Very few people can achieve that. 14 Well, yeah. But it was an interesting thing. Yeah.

Heather Bicknell  16:07  
I was gonna ask if you find the, the ring and your watch to help you along in that way, like in the incremental target kind of way, if it works for you.

Ryan Purvis  16:19  
Yeah, so I'm completely obsessed by it. To the extent that, like I mentioned before, I will be doing exercise at night, to make sure that I don't miss something. So I've set myself a goal of 15,000 steps a day. So I always, always get that will get very close to my 14,000 to 15,000, I may only need 12 and a half 1000 for my wife to paid for but but I've set the goal of 15,000. I think that's attainable. And it is, you know, most days, in fact, most days, I'm sitting at 18 to 20,000. I also set the goal that I will that Marines always be close to my Apple Watch. So you know, at the moment that you can't see now that the move one is 949, exercise 65 and the standing is 12. So, you know, those those, you know, the tick the boxes there. And then from a seed point of view, while I try to as much sleep as I can, with an infant, but that's why the meditation is so important because you know, when you when you get if you had a rough night's sleep, and you get to sort of 11 o'clock, 12 o'clock, and you and you're starting to hit the wall, having a 10 minute break. And I've actually actually now know that I've seen the results. Now I'm training my brain, the minute I when I hear those sounds that I use of a tentative break, I can almost feel myself drop into the subtle mental state of relaxing, and it doesn't have to give me 10 minutes, give me five minutes, I'll wake up and I'll be like, okay, I feel like I can carry on, I may have to do that later in the day if I haven't finished it, because I might be tired from the night before. But I can see all of that in the data, that the HRV is going up and down and the body temperatures have changed. And that's where it's been quite interesting to see because it actually sets you up. Not only from a mental point of view, but also from a physical point of view, I know when I do a workout that if I'm feeling a bit tired, I should still do the workout. But I may not push it nearly as hard as I would on a good night's sleep. But I'm still doing motions. And once you once you committed, but you do the first five minutes, five minutes, I'll just do the next next five minutes, the next five minutes, the next five minutes. And then next thing you know, you've done to 30 minutes. And of course, you know, while I'm doing all that the next podcast and whatever it is, so I'm not concentrating just on how much effort there is doing the exercise. I'm just doing this. And my brain is getting information isn't going. So. So yeah, that's definitely definitely worked for me. Yeah, I

Heather Bicknell  18:59  
think a lot of it is how how much how good you are at sticking to, you know what the technology is telling you to do, where it's what goals, you know, you set and paying attention to them.

Ryan Purvis  19:12  
You can change the ring measurement so So the one thing I don't do, which I used to do, is if you if the end of the week Apple Watch will tell you that you've you've had a wonderful week, good week on another try and push up your movements. Now usually. My my thing was like 16 165, I was going for a run in the morning, I was walking to the office, I was walking back from the office, I was going to gym in the middle of the day I was climbing 10 flights of stairs, two or three times, you know, just a lot of a lot of a lot of physical exertion. And you couldn't do that seven days a week and then you get to the weekend and the weekend a little more chilled. And you're hitting 800 900 you're feeling like you're failing which actually not failing because you want the limits are just excessive. So just capitalize Hit the limit that 800. Again, that's just that's a minimum that's easy to hit. And anything above that, you know, you feel good about it. So what I want to try and hit now, and this is where those accelerators come in, is I try and double the new thing. So at this moment, try and 16 120 400. And then those are days where, you know, no, I've really pushed hard. You know, I've got to play golf, you know, 18 holes of golf. That works really well to bring up your numbers. You mean? Yeah, you know,

Heather Bicknell  20:32  
18 hours? That'd be a long.

Ryan Purvis  20:35  
Sorry. You're walking and putting your bag? Yeah, they'll they'll do it. And then also, you know, with with the standing, you have a standing desk, so it's very easy to roll out 12 increments of standing because I'm always standing. So I definitely think it's changed my behavior for the better. And it says a little obsessive. So like, I get upset when I'm flying an airplane, I know that I'm, I'm going to struggle hit my 30 minutes, I was doing workout before I fly, which, you know, again, it's the right behavior. before traveling,

Heather Bicknell  21:15  
I wonder if they're ever gonna get sophisticated enough, because it seems like as far as I know, none of these have a anything to tell you, you know, you're working too hard, or you're pushing it too hard. Or like, you know, maybe don't set your move goal to burn 2000 calories a day, or they don't ever try to stop you from going

Ryan Purvis  21:34  
further. So the current Apple products on like that, but the ordering does that Oreo will tell you every morning when you wake up and look at you to give you a score out of 100. So this morning, when I woke up early said this morning. So this morning, I was just sleep Come on. Hello. We all did yesterday. So yesterday I was 64 for readiness. So says don't push it looks like someone kept your heart rate up last night to give your body the rest of the time. Take it easy today. Now that their heart rate could have been due to loss of one find loss of one and fix your sleep. It could have been we had a really big lamb dinner. So So fatty meat, but also eat to sleep at 11 hours awake at four o'clock with a two to stand up during the night which would have been one of the kids. Yeah, so that that is that is taken easy. I did I take it easy. No, I did a workout. But I didn't do my my high intensity workout. I did my my strength workout. Which is me trying to do pull ups and and all that kind of stuff. So I do that for the certain exercises you do to build up your strength puller. Yeah, so Deveney effects are definitely safe. It's interesting. It's it's a worthwhile investment. I think, in some senses, the combination of the two with Apple watches. Now this one also does blood, blood oxygen levels. I think that's also quite interesting, because you want to keep an eye on this, as well. Yeah. So I'm waiting for the real time glucose monitor glucose monitor that you can just have and the other thing I was interested in the other day for your ketones when you're doing ketogenic diet automatically collected and samples, do you just want to have a Health app that tells you everything?

Heather Bicknell  23:47  
Right, I mean, that's the goal, right is to get to that perfect system where it's like, a little bit of the Apple Watch and the ring to where it's like it really understands what behavior for that day is truly going to optimize your health because of course, if you've only slept three hours, maybe you don't want to do that, you know, hour of hit, because it's not going to be good for you in the end. But yeah, it is interesting. Sort of hire able to pull together bits and pieces for now.

Ryan Purvis  24:18  
I was listening to podcasts today about about music as well. artificially generated music, I think the product is called 1111 or something. Kevin Rose on the Kevin Rose show. And what they're saying there is and I agree with us, which would be true AI is is when you when you come home from work or you arrive in the house, the AI has worked out that you need to hear a certain type of music to bring your mood up because you've been around. So it could be like a like a jazzy, uplifting house track too. But it's not. It's not music music. It's a soundscape. You know so to start up Armstrong potentially playing a song It's a sound That brings up the mood. And then once you mix in a New York astronomers as your favorite, you know, jazz musician, for example. And the lights will be adjusted, you know, so because we're going into winter, it's darker earlier. So, you know, you'd have more white light, you know, up until say, 6:37pm, and automatically become more rigid, more warm as you get going to be in and stuff. And then ordering tells you what time I should go to bed. So I get a message two hours before saying, you know, your ideal time to go to sleep tonight will be 930. So start preparing yourself to go to sleep at some ideal times 11 o'clock. So it's kind of working out and based on my readiness factor, how much they know how much of pressure, I've got to go to sleep. And I must admit, it's fairly accurate, like the nights when I'm literally going to bed at 10 o'clock. And I've looked at the data flow is ideal times 1005. And I've crashed, I've gone straight to sleep and anything. So I think the data is there. And just bring it all together. So the trick?

Heather Bicknell  26:05  
Yeah. How do you charge the ring? Just out of curiosity?

Ryan Purvis  26:09  
It's got a cradle. So just take a look at a thing. So you can see the camera to see the little sensors on the inside. Yeah, those go into a cradle. So I think these sensors are what's what's measuring of the skin. But there's also like a, like a CI charger? Learning. Okay. Sorry, did I make a movement? On Wednesday, my goal on Friday? Yeah, so one last comment last night, five days. So the only issue I've ever had with Apple Watch is still the battery life. So I don't typically wear the ring as well. I got frustrated switching between watches and two watches. And to have one for sleeping and one for staying awake. That kind of thing. And it's very frustrating update process. Because you it's not a nice way to do it. You've almost got to tell the phone to use the one Why should we update that finish and then switch the other ones and you just shouldn't be

Unknown Speaker  27:17  

Ryan Purvis  27:18  
So having the ring is is my go to for sleep. Oh, that's why doesn't have that I forgot to forgot to wear the ring muscle charges flats, and that's going to wear it. That's why there's no data, which is very weak normally. But it's it's if you take that if you between all of them. As long as I get a view on how much sleep I've gotten, it definitely sets up my day. And my tolerance levels for certain activities. So it was that the question was something else?

Heather Bicknell  27:49  
No, I just asked how it is charged. So I was curious why it makes sense if you have a flat on the charger, but I guess you do you see? What do you follow all the rules from both of them? Are you seeing like the benefits and energy and mood? And is that what keeps you going with it?

Ryan Purvis  28:07  
Um, yes and no. So sometimes it says I take it easy. And my tapas it says though, I will push it, I will push you know you push on new, you can get the get the the level up, you know to do the workout or whatever it is. But what I find often exhausted by like it's not the workout it's from it's after the workout. That's the problem. So I've definitely noticed that by having that information and not not discarding it but actually going okay, and the reason why I say integrity today is not the workout because you know, you always you always want to, you always want to stress the muscles, so they're always getting tested. But is anyone who's done anything in the sports world knows your recovery is more important than the actual training. And that's where it took me so long you know going to work say for clock in the morning and be like great on sleep and I'll be pumped. I'll be energetic the whole day. And I'll have some mornings I get up at six o'clock I'll do work and I'm tired or suffer the whole day. And I regret in workout. So it is helping in that sense to you know, to trust your body a little bit more not override it all the time. So So yeah, it's working.

Heather Bicknell  29:24  
The ring sounds interesting.

Ryan Purvis  29:26  
Yeah, it's, it's, it's been a few podcasts. One guy Ben green Greenfield, he mentioned quite a lot. There's a lot of these devices that come around, I tend not to buy the first one that I hear about, I tend to wait and see and wait and see. And if I see enough of the people that are listened to talking about something then I'll look at it so Apple Watch has come out a few times. Not always as the best choice. orderings always come out as a pretty good option. There are a few others. And it's not it's not cheap. I mean, I think it was about 300 bucks or 400 bucks to get But for what I'm getting out of Data Wise, I think it's paying for itself. And then finally, after that resilience report I was talking about the one thing she said is your energy levels are high. And that's not what she's expecting to see right now. And I said, Well, you know, because we obviously she asked, you know, what is your feeling? Oh, the report is pretty much what I expected to say. That's exactly what I was quite surprised. Because your energy levels are high. And most people's engineering was like 20% 30%, and yours isn't the 70% or something like that. And it's because not only of being fit and staying fit, but also putting in boundaries and, and ways to stop things interfering with my mental health and all that kind of stuff, which we'll talk about that in more detail. But I think a large part of that is by having the data to say, you know, if I don't create boundaries, and others work all day long, then I mean, not only for myself, but for the family as well, because you take your exhausted, work, say into dinner, and you're grouchy and you compete and you shorten, and you try to come down the chain with energy to actually come down.

Unknown Speaker  31:16  

Heather Bicknell  31:18  
No, I that's definitely something that I, I mean, I'm probably in the, whatever the 30s, or whatever the, the slit was at the energy, because if you're not, I think for me, and I'm sure other people have experienced this as well. But, you know, back in March, when we first went home, it was like, this is a temporary condition. So what I'm doing now, I don't have to worry about the long term implications of it. But now that we're, you know, so many months beyond, it's like, Okay, well, I do need to, you know, set boundaries and prioritize movement, and, you know, pay more attention to, you know, take care of myself a little bit better. Instead of being in such a, like an emergency sort of reactive, always on state, but it's hard to make that change, I think you really have to be, you know, just really on top of yourself and really committed to it.

Ryan Purvis  32:12  
Yeah, and I think we all did that. I mean, you know, within that first sort of April period, we went lockdown. It was like, fantastic. Here's all this extra time and all this stuff I can do. Also, I mean, I definitely burnt out by the end of April. And I was like, actually, no, this is not working, I need to fix I need to change the way this works. And physical exercise is one of those things that I kept forgetting work on physical exercise, and what I've had to do at the moment, but the exercises first get that done, because that that sets up everything else for the rest of the day. Because it shows again, that physical exercise is always a difficult thing to do. Yeah. At least in my house.

Heather Bicknell  32:55  
You're a morning person, right? versus a night owl. Would you say

Ryan Purvis  32:59  
I'm actually both? Okay, so, so

Unknown Speaker  33:02  
actually funny, I did a 23andme and his genetic marker for it. And depending on your genes, you could be the one but I'm actually in the middle. Okay.

Heather Bicknell  33:11  
I know, I guess I'm just thinking, I'm curious if others like me, who are night owls are struggling more during this time with some of those adjustments, because I realized that if I if I got up earlier to work out before work, that that's, that's really the best way to do it, that I don't have to worry about, you know, if I'm working out in the middle of the day, even if I'm just taking 20 minutes, am I going to miss something, you know, some critical message that comes in, or, you know, if I push work until, you know, six or seven at night, and then it's dinner time, and then you know, I don't want to work out because I just ate or whatever, it just doesn't happen. So I think morning would be better, if I could, you know, fix my sleep cycle. But to some extent, I think, you know, there's some genetic factors that make that really challenging.

Ryan Purvis  34:00  
I mean, it does come down to, you know, to what the boundaries, you know, blocking out your diary. And over one hour, slept in the middle of my day that's bogged down. And he says break do not. Because, you know, when I did when I was, you know, literally, and I'm sure everyone's been to calls in a row. Yeah. Everyone books, those calls. And you're like, Can you not see my diary? Like, I'm that's full internal book, another meeting inside of, you know,

Heather Bicknell  34:25  
like triple books all the time. And then I have to move things. Yeah.

Ryan Purvis  34:30  
So I've set up two things for that. One is if I set up a meeting, it's never a flower, never full half an hour, it's always five minutes or 10 minutes short. And that you can set an outlook. So the other thing that I do is have the rules that the kick outs If anyone tries to book me to the time book, a slot that's already booked the cons and start away. Yeah. And just that just saves me having to do Yeah,

Heather Bicknell  34:56  
that's a good idea. Do we need to wrap up?

Ryan Purvis  34:58  
Yeah, that's cool.

Heather Bicknell  35:02  
Yeah, no.

Did you have a final thought I cut you off? Um,

Ryan Purvis  35:06  
no, I was just gonna say just on the Safa books. I've just finished my latest latest book from my favorite author. tale I think it's book 15 of the series. And yeah, he's he took a lot longer to bring this one out and into the service layer. Sorry, that's the one. And it's going back to his old style of riding. I think he rushed in last couple. Really good. So he's just finished. This is now the end of the pipe to this. This is book city of 75. I'm hoping he doesn't run out of steam. Because these books are really, really like, you know, good to read. But they're just they're not that aren't heavy reads. And they're full of they're always moving. They're always action. So it's always a good story to read. I think this one took me a good. Yeah, four hours, three hours to read. So it was it was nice. Nicely paced. definitely recommended. Yeah, so that would that be my my final thought. Cool.

Heather Bicknell  36:15  
Talk to you later.

Ryan Purvis  36:16  
Is I thank you for listening today's episode. And the big news, our producer editor. Thank you, Heather. for your hard work for this episode. Please subscribe to the series and rate us on iTunes or the Google Play Store. Follow us on Twitter at the DW w podcast. The show notes and transcripts will be available on the website WWW dot digital workspace that works. Please also visit our website www dot digital workspace that works and subscribe to our newsletter. And lastly, if you found this episode useful, please share with your friends or colleagues.

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